My biggest take-away from the discussion is that the relationship between Luo, the narrator, Four-Eyes, and the little seamstress is not identical, i.e. each character relates to the other three in unique ways. One thing I'm still wondering about is what the exact impact is that Balzac is having on them.
I think that reading the book by Balzac is impacting the boys by exposing them a new culture, and making them eager to learn more about it. This is why the go through so much trouble so Four Eyes gives them more books. Balzac gives them a new motivation or goal in the period of their relocation.
1. Our class thinks that the relationships of the characters affects how they take action, and not that the actions the characters take affect their relationships. 2. How did Four Eyes and the narrator and Luo originally meet?
1. My biggest take away from this socratic is people's insights on how the little Chinese might slowly come in between the two friends. 2. Why do they not mention narrator actual name?
I think maybe one reason they do not mention the narrator's actual name is so that you can identify with him more. When you do not assign his characteristics to a name and a face, they are simply characteristics that you can identify in yourself and reflect on.
I think they didn't mention the narrator's name so the reader is able to live in the story more. Since they don't mention his name, it's easier for the reader to imagine themself as the narrator and being in his position.
I think that the reason the narrators name isn't mentioned is because not only will the reader be able to identify with them but also it helps maintain the idea that anyone could be in his position. So many nameless teens were forced into re-education and the fact that we don't know the narrators name makes it more encompassing. He's just another teen being re-educated and finding himself.
1. My biggest take away was that some negative things are probably coming. We brought a lot of light to all the dangerous things going on and I think that it'll be interesting to see their consequences. 2. One question I still have is who is the narrator? We actually don't know a lot about him. It's kind of weird how we're seeing the story through his eyes and we never see him. What's he like? What's his name?
I have to disagree with your opinion on how we are given a limited amount of information of the narrator. Since the book is written from a first hand view, we are able to get to know the narrator very well from his thoughts and actions as the story progresses.
1) The Little Seamstress comes in between the friendship, not too much, but it's revealing the 3/1000 chance. 2) What really is what will make you 3/1000?
I think to be one of the 3/1000 you have to obey all the rules during your re-education and be approved to leave by the peasants. It helps if your parents aren't very well-known intellectuals. This is why the narrator and Luo think they don't have much of a chance of leaving, because their parents are fairly well-known for their occupations.
1. My biggest take-away is that in the future Luo may start to pay less attention to his friend and more attention to the Seamstress, which may cause some tensions. 2. Does the narrator really like the Seamstress specifically or is he just using her as a physical manifestation of his desire to be mature and find love? Everybody's opinions on this were different so this question is not fully resolved in my mind.
I personally think that the narrator doesn't really like the Seamstress, because he's barely had any personal interaction with her. To him, she's just a symbol of what Luo has, but he doesn't have. He's jealous of Luo because he feels that shift in their relationship that's been going on ever since they arrived at the village. Luo seems to fit in better here, with his storytelling abilities, and the narrator envies that about him.
One major recurring topic I noticed was that as Luo becomes closer to the Seamstress, this may affect his friendship with the narrator and could jeopardize the way the two friends perceive one another during their time in the mountains. I am still unsure about the importance, significance Four Eyes has on the boys?
Four-Eyes is important as his books represent Western Culture to the boys. In a place where they are surrounded by illiterate peasants, his books signify civilization and literature and a way to escape the mountain, if only for a short period of time.
Four-Eyes is the one that introduced Balzac's books to the boys and they will shape how they come to view the world. Though we are not yet sure of the exact importance, you can tell that the books will give them a sense of importance and make them feel more educated. He is also the reason they go to visit the hermit in the mountains and that might become significant later. He shows them how friendships can change when one person has a higher motive.
Today I was able to think more deeply about the relationships between Luo, the Seamstress and the Narrator. How the concept of jealousy will play a role in the development of the characters and how they interact?
I think that both author is saying that both the narrator and Luo like the seamstress and I think that in the future there will be some tension between the two.
I think that the jealousy will slowly pry them apart. The narrator was constantly used to being the more talented and intelligent of the two friends and their is no telling of what will happen when these roles are reversed.
1. It seems as though there will be a lot more about the relationship between Luo, the Seamstress, and the narrator. The discussion also seemed to keep coming back to foreshadowing things like Luo's death, Four Eyes getting in trouble, and the man on the Thousand Metre Cliff becoming a central character.
2. Why does the narrator continually leave out names? (his own, the Seamstress)
This is not necessarily what the author intended, but maybe he had the narrator leave out names to show how people's individuality and identity were taken away by Mao's reign, the cultural revolution, re-education, etc.
I was wondering about that as well! None of the characters except for Luo actually seem to have names. I think this is because the names of the characters aren't actually important to us, it's what they do that matters. The Little Seamstress sews clothes and helps them deceive the old miller, Four Eyes is called that because of his glasses, and he has a secret suitcase of books.
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is that the little Chinese seamstress changed the dynamics of Luo's and the narrators relationship, which could lead to them both changing. I think that it sets a good foundation for questions that ask where the story will be going in terms of plot.
2. After today's discussion, I wonder what the relationship between Four Eyes, Luo, and the narrator is like, and how they are all different.
1. The question of whether the narrator is jealous of the Luo's relationship specifically with the Little Seamstress, or he is just jealous that Luo has an intimate relationship with someone in general. ( I think he's actually jealous of the Little Seamstress, rather than Luo.) 2. Does the emphasis on the fact that a character dubbed Four Eyes is hiding secret books mean something?
I think he is called Four-Eyes because he wears glasses, however this may be considered a stereotype of intellectuals, just like having a large amount of books.
1. The relationship between Luo and the narrator has changed a lot since the beginning of the book: the narrator used to pity Luo for not having any special talents, but now he's jealous of him for fitting in so well with the village and developing a relationship with the Little Seamstress. 2. Will this changing of relationships affect Luo and the narrator's chances of being able to go back to the city?
In answer to your question, I believe that it will affect their chances of returning. If they keep getting involved in the business of Four Eyes, who would rather sacrifice his friends than stay in re-education forever, they will most likely be caught and never return home to the city.
I feel like the tension rising between them could potentially cost them their chance back into the city. Since in the village, they basically only have each other and depend on each other to complete their tasks.
Do we think that this gap will spread between Luo and narrator or they will realize their differences can benefit each of them and their friendship will continue to grow?
I think that Four Eyes' perception of the world has already changed because of the journalist job; he has now become willing to endanger his friends in order to get out of re-education. He has been overcome with the selfish need to get himself out of there, putting himself above his friends and changing the lyrics of the old man's song.
Four-Eyes is becoming increasingly more and more infatuated with his goal of becoming a journalist, and although his worldview may not have been much different before, it will certainly become one centered around himself above all else.
I believe it has already shaped his world view. I do not think it is that he wants the journalist job that bad, but he wants to live up to what his parents wanted for him. Since he was isolated from his parents and their guidance because of his re-education, he still wants to make them proud of him by obtaining the journalist job.
I think that to Four-eyes the job means hope, a way to escape and become 3/1000. I think he would go very far to keep that hope, and so that may affect his view on the world.
1. Luo and the narrator's relationship is likely to undergo some major changes due to the dynamics with the Little Seamstress as the novel continues. 2. Based on what we have seen of the narrator's character so far, is he likely to t towards Luo because he is jealous of the Little Seamstress?
1. There is budding jealousy and we are starting to see bits of separation int he relationship of Luo and The Narrator, the seamstress has a part in this but other things like ambition and personality also seem to be splitting the two friends. 2. The books that 4 eyes has hidden away. Will more of them be revealed to us ? What will Luo and the narrator have to do to get more books and how far will they go for books?
The books will most likely come up more later, based on the fact that the title has Balzac in it (so his books must be important to the plot) and the fact that the narrator speaks about how much the books impacted their lives later.
I think that the books will have a very large impact on the character's development. It is the only outside knowledge they have had in their whole life, and answering your question I think that they will go very far to get the books.
1. The relationship between Luo, the narrator and the Seamstress is a little twisted with jealousy and some hidden emotions and distrust, and the relationship between Luo and the narrator and Four-Eyes is murky with some hidden intentions and differing values. 2. Is the Seamstress able to tell the Luo doesn't fully love her the way she loves him?
How do we know that Luo doesn't love the Seamstress like she loves him? So far in the story, we haven't actually seen too much of their relationship, we have only had it told to us by Luo and he seems to be pretty invested in her. The way he was excited to go and tell her Balzac's story showed that he was genuinely interested in sharing his excitement with her.
I don't think she's able to tell right away because of the amount of attention and affection Luo is giving her at the moment. But I think later on in the story the Little Seamstress will realize Luo's true intentions and about how he feels about her.
1. Luo is starting to put the narrator after the Little Seamstress, making him jealous. Four Eyes is concerned for his future, whereas Luo and the narrator are living in the moment. 2. How will the Little Seamstress cause tension between the two boys in the future?
I think Luo is going to be more interested in spending time with the Little Seamstress than the narrator, and ultimately might result in him not wanting to go home.
I think the narrator will become more and more jealous of their relationship, whether it being that she pulls Luo away from him, or that he too wants to find love.
The narrator's jealousy of the relationship or of Luo's love will most likely come in play later in the book. Also, the title of the book definitely means that the Little Seamstress has something to do with the author of the book(Balzac)Four Eyes gave the boys, so that definitely will cause some kind of event between the Little Seamstress and the two boys.
1. Luo and thenarator are very different to each other, and their differences might affect the rest of the story. 2. Are Luo and the narrator becoming less worried about their future?
I feel like because Luo and the narrator are caught up with so many other things in their re-education process they are becoming less worried about their future and they've realized that they have a slim chance of making it out of the process so they are really trying to live life to the fullest.
I think they are still worried about their future, they have just come to accept that they are stuck where they are so they started changing their thoughts to where they are now.
I don't think they're becoming less worried, in a sense they are becoming more distracted by other things. Luo with the Little Seamstress and the narrator with Blazac and the books.
1. All of the main characters in the story have their own unique traits that characterize who they are, and can be extremely different as a result. However, they are also all connected in their pursuit of acquiring new knowledge and becoming increasingly more intellectual.
2. Can the connections of the characters be sturdy enough to hold them all together, or can their differences be enough to become alienated from each other?
My biggest take-away from today was probably the fact that the narrator is jealous of Luo not just because he has the little seamstress, but also because he has a better set of skills for living the rural farming labor lifestyle. It seems that more people like Luo even thought he has no specialized skills. The jealously will probably in the future affect the relationship between Luo and the narrator.
My question is: Why does four eyes feel so afraid of all of the villagers and so nervous when they are around?
He is always nervous when the other villagers are around because he wants to impress them. To be one of the 3/1000 you have to impress the villagers, and they have to like you, so Four Eyes feels pressured to do everything right around them.
My biggest take-away from today's Socratic was the discussion about the different priorities and values of all the characters, and I'm interested in how that will develop further on in the book. What motivates Four-Eyes to keep those books, even though he is so terrified of upsetting the revolutionaries?
think that four eyes has the books because he can't let go of his home. He constantly has the idea that he must return home and the books are almost like incentive. He is willing to alienate his best friend to get home so keeping books as a reminder seems rational for him.
I think that Four Eyes is motivated by his desire to become journalist. This is a goal for him and to reach that goal, he is willing to take certain risks.
I think that Four-Eyes is motivated to keep the books because he might be having a hard time letting go of his life back home. He probably is still getting used to the situation that he has been put through and might even be a little bit angry about it. The books probably feel like something that is constant. Also, Four-Eyes is concerned about getting this job, and a background of literature and having references will probably help. I think it is a struggle for control, and having the books or having the job might be a way for him to have more control.
1. Tension has been building between Luo and the narrator because of the Little Seamstress and their differing personalities. Their friendship with the Little Seamstress has weakened their strong bond, and the narrator's jealousy of Luo has potential for becoming an issue later on. 2. How were Four Eyes and his parents able to hide the books from the Red Guards?
1. I was the outside circle but hearing and taking notes refreshed my memory and it made me have a better understanding about the book and some questions I had were answered. 2. I predict Luo and the narrator are going to get in a fight.
I feel like because Luo and the Little Seamstress have developed such a fine relationship, the narrator is going to feel left out and thus become irritated with the fact that Luo has time to spend with a girl he has just met, while Luo and the narrator have been friends for a long time.
1. My biggest takeaway is a clearer understanding of Luo and the narrator's relationship. We examined in depth the tension that is caused by the Little Seamstress and the clash of personalities between the two boys. 2. How will Balzac's writing influence the Little Seamstress? There are amazing similarities between her and the character in Balzac's book. How will this affect how she makes decisions in the future?
I think the Little Seamstress will realize that Luo is not necessarily the right person for her to be with. Balzac's stories may open up her mind to the possibilities of being with other people, or even just being independent. Independence is not an ideal emphasized or encouraged in Chinese culture, and I think Balzac's writing may encourage her to think for herself.
1. Luo and the narrator are not really going to be friends because they are trying to find some way to stand out in the re-education process. Luo is really successful because he is able to entertain the people while the narrator is less successful because he has more intelligent talents which don't really work in the re-education world. 2. Is their a reason why four eyes gives Luo and the narrator that specific book authored by Balzac?
1) My biggest takeaway is probably seeing and acknowledging the different perspectives on many events that have happened in the book. Sharing out opinions and thoughts while listening and understanding other people's perspective really gives me a broader view of the book. It makes me view the meaning behind this book and many of the actions that happen in this book on a whole new level, since I was introduced to many new things that I would not have thought of on my own. 2) How will Luo and the narrator's relationship change throughout the book given the different factors that will influence it?
I think that the narrator and Luo may grow apart as they realize that they each value different ideals. The growing jealousy between them may drive them apart further.
I definitely think that the two boys' characters will butt heads and get in some fights because the strains in their relationship. I think that their friendship is tense because one of them is "succeeding" so to speak in terms of having a woman and being able to entertain people.
1. My biggest take away was the fact that the Narrator could possibly not be directly jealous of Luo and the Seamstress but that he could be jealous of having a relationship in general. 2. Will the relationship between Luo and the Seamstress destroy the friendship between the narrator and luo?
I like your idea on not being directly jeaous of Luo and the LCS but of just a relationship. Are there any other women around for the narrator to start a relationship with? Is the LCS his only option?
1. The biggest takeaway I had from today was the predictions that everyone had about the future. There were a few about if the narrator and Luo were going to run away and a few about weather or not the narrator felt jealous about Luo and the seamstress. Not all the questions were answered and I felt that the discussion was more focused on the little details that were in the book.
2. How does the narrator feel about the Seamstress and Luo?
I felt like the biggest take away had to do with the relationships between the four main characters, the narrator, Luo, the Little Seamstress, and Four-Eyes. There relationships and the way they interact with each other has changed since the beginning of the book and will continue to develop in a way that increases conflict.
A question I still have is how Four-Eyes and his parents were able to sneak out the books. How will Four-Eyes books affect his future plans?
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is the influence of the Little Seamstress and the book upon Luo and the narrator. I think they will both affect Luo and the narrator's relationship either in positive or negative ways. Whether or not it will tear them apart, though, is unclear. 2. Will the old man with the songs come into play more? Will Luo and the narrator visit him in an attempt to gain knowledge about the culture of their surroundings?
1. The biggest takeaway from this discussion was that everyone focused a lot on was the fact that everyone thought the biggest change because of Balzac has not happened yet in the book. People believe that the impacts from Balzac's book can be extended even further for coming of age. 2. Why doesn't Four-Eyes trust the narrator and Luo?
My biggest take-away from this socratic seminar was are the characters really growing up? Are they coming of age properly? Is it too fast because they are being forced to be independent and work on their own? This is a big topic that I can relate most of the quotes to and find more quotes about that will help me figure out my opinion on these questions. Is Luo using the Little Seamstress or is the Little Seamstress using Luo? Both have different motives that could play in to what's is going to happen.
1. My biggest take away from today's discussion is the influence that the book had on the children. I think a lot of conflict is going to arise within themselves because they want to stick to the rules and ideals of Communism in order to hold on to the bit of hope they have of returning home. At the same time, they want to expand their perspective and are getting influenced by movies and novels. A main take away is it is really easy to be influenced and conflicting when you are growing up and coming of age. 2. How will the books and movies they see in the future affect Luo and the narrator? Will they rebel? Or will they conform in order to be sent back home?
I think that at first they will conform in order to be sent back home. However eventually I think they will lose hope in being sent back home by being good so they will try to be sent home by rebelling.
My biggest takeaway from this discussion was centered on the coming of age of the characters, and how they way they are growing up now is very different from the way that they would have grown up if the cultural revolution had not happened.
A question I still have is the way that the narrator feels about Luo and the little seamstress. At first, he didn't seem to be bothered by it, but now he is a little jealous.
1. An important idea of this discussion is the theme of coming of age and how re-education has affected and shaped their lives. We discussed how Luo and the narrator were forced to guide themselves through their lives, and had no influence from their parents to help them on their journey.
2. Has the cultural revolution piqued Luo and the narrator's interest in books simply because they are banned? Does it make them want to read even more than they did before the revolution?
That is a great question, but another thought you can add to that is whether they just thought the book was interesting, or if the cultural revolution and hearing all of this for the first time is adding to that as well.
Yes, I think that now because that they are banned, their interest has been sparked and they want to read more now. They want to know what is so bad about books that they have been banned. They also are very interested now after reading one book.
1. The biggest take-away from today for me was the different ideas of growing up. There were many places in which people pointed out coming of age quotes and ideas that I didn't notice, and that was really interesting. The most thought-evoking question was the one about them being forced to grow up or not because of the area in which they live. 2. How much pain will Luo and the narrator go through in order to keep some freedoms and be the 3 in 1,000 that get sent back to their village?
1. The largest takeaway I gathered from this Socratic is that the lack of outside world influence could seriously mess up one's education. 2. What relationship does the narrator desire with the seamstress? Could he be jealous of the level of intimacy held by Luo and she?
1. My biggest take-away from today is how this quote, "...not for a moment did we image that our lives, particularly Lou's, were about to be completely shaken up" (20) will relate to the rest of the book and how we already see this starting to happen when Luo sees the little seamstress after reading the Balzac book.
2. One question I have from today's socratic seminar is are the kids being forced to grow up while they are still too young and not ready?
Luo and the narrator in a sense are being pressured to grow up. As many others have noted during the first half, the children are forced to care for themselves without any parental supervision or support, which is causing them to make their own mistakes instead of their parents explain what they should or shouldn't do. This is causing the Luo and the narrator to make descisions that may seem radical, but to them they are just ignorant of what mistakes they might be making. So yes, the children are being forced to grow at too fast.
1. My biggest take-away from the discussion was the idea that the clock stands for much more than it actually did. By moving it around, it shows that even though Lou and the main character were given responsibilities and left on their own, they still could not be trusted to be completely responsible and honest all of the time. 2. What influence will the Little Seamstress have on Lou and the main character? Was the main character's flash of jealousy because of the book that he just read or will it grow to something that might tear them apart?
I think that the flash of jealousy he was referring to may stem from him possibly thinking that the Seamstress could be taking away the friendship he had with Luo. He feels like he's kind of losing his best friend.
1. My biggest take away was coming to a greater understanding of how their "special" enviroment they live in is affecting the Narrator and Luo (growing up too fast).
2. What role will Balzac have later in the book? (Because it's in the title but it hasn't had a too big influence).
The Balzac book is influencing the boys because they are being reminded of true feelings, such as passion and love. When they remember these feelings and emotions, the boys act upon their feelings.
Currently in the story, Balzac's book has a tremendous influence on the boys and the seamstress. The romantic story is unlike anything they have ever read, so in a way it already has a big influence. I think that Balzac will continue to influence the story as the main characters read more and more of his books.
1. My biggest take-away was how much the idea of a "set path" affected the minds of my classmates. I had not thought about that, exactly, as I was more immersed in the theme of the adolescent life in the isolated villages, but it made me think quite a bit about your destiny and how that can change so very quickly. For example, Four Eyes was destined to be a writer. The moment he had to be re-located, he probably imagined that his destiny would be as an aging, lonely worker in a village far away, forever locked in abandon. However, his parents saw an opportunity to change that destiny by giving him the books and keeping him educated from afar. That was a take-away that formed in my mind after today's Socratic. 2. What does it mean to be happy? With the books now educating them and their social interactions in the village, with the seamstress, Four Eyes, and their immersion into the community, could Luo and the narrator potentially be happy as they grow up into adults?
I think happiness is very subjective. The seastresses father for example seems very happy with his life, and because of that people like being around him. Also the village headmaster also seems pretty content with his life despite having a lot less than other people. I think the mere fact that the narrator and luo have had better makes them upset becuase they compare what they have to what they had, but with the introduction of these books maybe they will be able to see the beauty in what they have. Four-eyes was blinded in this lastest chapter by his need to get home, so while he may be happy in the momment im not sure it will last.
To be happy means to be satisfied with what onself, their desires, their peers, and/or their actions. However, this satisfaction does not necessarily have to be in good-nature and benevolence, but rather for selfish benefit. For example, Four-Eyes sees an opportunity to escape resettlement by presenting authentic folk songs and become a journal editor. However, he claims that the songs that Luo and the Narrator present to him are offensive and "...useless garbage...". Therefore, he decides to tweak the words, and in doing so, ruining the authenticity of the piece but making it more presentable to the journal. He feels delighted that there is an opportunity to escape the resettlement, but he accomplished this through means that may not be ethically sound. Therefore, it is possible to be happy, but perhaps not necessarily for the right reason. For example, Luo feel happy in the company of The Little Seamstress not because she is a good friend, but rather because she can satisfy the adolescent desires of Luo.
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is how it is difficult to tell whether Luo and the narrator are growing up too fast during their resettlement, or if they are struggling with growing up and taking responsibility for themselves now that they are independent from their parents. 2. What are the narrator and Luo willing to do to get their hands on more books from Four-Eyes?
I agree, and it would be interesting to know how they are growing up differently in the Phoenix of the Sky rather than in the traditional city environment that they're used to
Luo and the narrator seem to be willing to do practical anything! Last night's reading, in which the boys got in that emotional and heated fight put on display their intensity and eagerness to get a book. They will fight long and hard for it. At first, their hardest battle was to get home and be one of the three in a thousand, but now, it seems like they will fight just as hard to get their hands on a book.
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is that Four-Eyes is becoming more and more of an important character in the story. Even though he was just introduced, he has already given Mozart and Luo something that will change their lives forever. 2. Why did Four-Eyes give Mozart and Luo the specific book by Balzac? Was it a coincidence or does it have a significance?
I believe that Four-Eyes chose to give that book was because it was the smallest, rattiest of the bunch he had stowed away in his hidden suitcase. On page 55 the narrator states "-a thin, worn volume. The authors' name was Balzac." I would theorize that he gave them the smallest one, as to avoid giving away hints to the real treasures in his case,
1) With the restrictions of the reeducation, the main characters are forced to grow up quickly and possibly faster than they should be. They are having to conform to the communist ideology and the work load of the village. 2)When is a person really grown up? If the characters are forced to grow up too quickly, should they really be treated as adults? I am also unclear on how this could affect them in the future. Adolescent actions with adult topics can lead to adult consequences.
It's interesting to see how they grow up in such a restricted environment without the guidance of their parents. I feel as if soon they will face consequences for their actions that they have taken, without any guidance.
My biggest take-away relates to the connection between being forced to grow up and how it influences people. For example, Luo and the narrator change the time on the rooster as a way to cope, and the seamstress's father acts more childish because his wife died.
I still have questions about other ways being forced to grow up will influence a person.
I think that it will mainly change the way people view the world and their experiences based on the knowledge they have. If they are forced to grow up at a faster rate than they want, they may view the world in a more negative way than others.
1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was that I realized that the narrator and Luo was growing up really fast but not necessarily for the better, especially with the scene under the ginkgo tree. 2.My question is that why don't the author reveal the narrator's name?
I think that there could be a lot of reasons for the narrator not to have his named revealed. To begin with, it adds a mysterious aspect to the narrator, and makes him feel a little less impersonal. Throughout the novel you get to learn a lot about the narrator, but there will always be that small basic thing that you will never know, which makes the book much more interesting in a different way.
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is the influence re-education has on Lou, the narrator, and Four-Eyes. The discussion on if they are growing up too quickly, and if it's a good thing. How is being re-educated affecting them. 2. How will the Balzac book continue to play a role in the rest of the story? Are they going to get more books?
The question if they are growing up to quickly was also a take away I had chosen. From my point of view I believe they are growing up to quickly. In the wrong ways.
1. Learned that the relationship between Luo and the little seamstress could be used later in the story to give more power to Luo because of her father. 2. I did not get to ask my question if coming of age is affected by the age of the people around you.
I think it is, because if the people around you are more mature, you might take longer because you know that there's nothing really at stake; on the contrary, if everyone else is younger than you, you're going to have to be much more mature a lot faster.
My biggest take away from the discussion today is that Luo and the narrator are being forced to grow up so fast, so is that really going to be beneficial to them and their re-education?
I think that growing up too fast might hurt the narrator and Luo in the long run, as they are not getting to experience their last moments of childhood, and eventually will not get the lessons from that childhood that will be important later in life.
1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was the significance in these small moments of freedom, coming of age, and simple experiences that mean so much to the narrator and Luo and what impact they have on them because of he suppressed society they live in. 2. Why is the narrator all of a sudden jealous, does he too have feeling for the little seamstress?
I think he is jealous because of reading the book by Balzac. He wants to be able to experience the same feelings that Luo has towards the little seamstress.
Biggest Take-Away: People think that Luo and the narrator are maturing/coming of age at a faster rate because of their repressed society. Originally I thought that they might be maturing at a slower rate because of their over-controlling society. Question: Where is the narrator's coat now? How does he feel about such incriminating evidence against him floating around in the world somewhere?
I don't see how their society is over-controlling besides deciding who is re-educated where, because once the people are re-educated, they're left on their own to finish their work and do whatever they want in between, giving them a sense of responsibility they probably didn't have before.
1. The discussion really made me look at the two chapters we had just read in a new light. Personally I didn't like these two chapters because there where only a few places where I felt a connection, unlike the previous chapters, but this talk opened my eyes (just like luo's and the narrators) to the important aspects in these chapters. 2. This discussion made me wonder: Is it possible to be yourself in a communist society or can you only truly be yourself in a capitalist free society or is it just our biased viewpoint that makes us think this way?
I think you can always be yourself, no matter what kind of society you live in. However, the society you live in will impact how much others can see into your true self.
For 1, I felt the same way. We had a connection with Luo and the narrator because we too are learning from our peers as they are learning from the peasants.
I believe that the society we live in and our surroundings always shape who we are, and that there is no such thing as one's "true self." Everyone fundamentally acts a certain way in different situations, so someone's identity might be different in a communist and capitalist society, but they will still be acting as themselves.
1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was about how Luo and the narrator are learning more about themselves without their parents. They are without guidance, which makes their understanding of things completely different from what they would have learned back home with their families. Now that they are in the countryside, they are faced with a lot of new responsibilities and have to learn to take care of themselves in a different way.
2. Because they are living under completely different circumstances, are they learning things in a less civilized, "bad" way? And is their Coming of Age turning out to be a good or bad thing?
Since both Luo and the narrator were deprived of learning advanced math and sciences, they have far less career options available in their future. Coming of Age is turning out to be a bad thing for them.
I think there are differences in the two cultures they were and are being raised in, but this manner might cause them to be less civilized, or effect them negatively. Living by themselves in the village without any parental guidance might result in some issues for them later on. Having that guidance while growing up is crucial for a healthy development. I think that it is a worse living environment than they were living in before at the city.
It may not be a less civilized way, but they are growing up much faster than they should be, because they lack the guidance of the average child, and so they must learn to fend for themselves within a completely different society, so their Coming of Age will be much different than they imagined. They are trying to grow up, but they really are still children.
I guess it is rather difficult to find categorize the main characters' coming of age as a good thing or a bad thing. Rather, the road that these individuals take may not be the best path to take, but it depends on how Luo and the Narrator learn from their situation.
My biggest take away from today's discussion was that the communist society was forcing Luo and the narrator grow up faster than a normal person would normally make the transition to adulthood. Because Luo and the narrator have been removed from their family, their new "parents" is the communist society, which forces them to mature at a systematic rate.
What is the significance of the name of the Little Chinese Seamstress not being revealed? Is it a cultural convention, or is it something purposely done by the author?
I think that the Little Chinese Seamstress actually does not play a huge role in the story. She serves as someone for Luo and the narrator to talk about and share stories with, but has not impacted the plot much. Also, the narrator may want to give her a sense of privacy or secrecy to keep the reader guessing.
I think that the significance of the Little Chinese Seamstress not given a name is either the same significance as the narrator not having a name, or to display that perhaps women were not treated as fairly. Also, it seems to be that people are defined by their place or role that they play (i.e. headmaster, narrator, farmer, etc).
In my opinion her name was undisclosed to leave uncertainty and wondering in the mind of the reader. Also I think that the the author purposefully did that to show that her name and place in society don't matter in the long run and in terms of her relationship with the boys.
I agree that there is definitely a shift in both Luo and the narrator, as they are forced to take control of their own lives. They have no parents to look after them, so they are essentially on their own.
The Little Seamstress does seem to have a very big role in the book, as her name is in the title. This also prompts me to question why her name as well as the narrator's name is never addressed so far in the book.
1. One big takeaway I had was hearing the opinion that the introduction to lust and impulsive actions that can be found in Western culture, such as Balzac's writing, may not be a good influence 2. Does forcing kids off the path set by their parents yield more or less possibilities for them?
I think the point of sending them off does teach them how to be more responsible. It also teaches the youth about how different life is for those who don't live in the city and opens up their perspective, in a way.
I think that the kids being forced off the path that their parents wanted them to take will lead to more possibilities for them, but not necessarily good possibilities.
1. My biggest take- away from today's Socratic Seminar was that how diverse the class thought about how the boys from the story were growing up. It was interesting to see how both arguments of the boys growing too fast, or not growing at all were both really valid ideas. That made you more aware of different perspectives- which was really cool to see.
2. Do the boys use one another to try and cope with their new life? They both only have one another and it seems like instead of crying and being sad they use each other to grow and in a way to move away from their past and move on with life.
You had a really interesting take for 2. I hadn't thought about them using each other to cope so much and it makes sense. And for 1, I agree, there was a lot of different mind sets being voiced and each was logical
I think that although they are probably very sad, they cannot dwell on that feeling and the memories that make them sad. I think they use each other to stay positive, and possibly start their own life together.
1. My biggest takeaway was the both boys seem to place their values on different things. The narrator seems to be placing all his priorities to retain as much information from the banned books he's getting from four eyes, while Luo places the Little Seamstress above everything else, making sure she's the one who "learns" from the banned books.
2. How did Four-Eyes manage to get a suitcase full of books past the red-guards, and what is the significance of Balzac and his books and how does it tie into the story?
1. My biggest takeaway is that we have seen a little impact on the characters lives but not enough 2. Will Luo and the narrator pursue their parents dreams?
My biggest take-away from the discussion is that the relationship between Luo, the narrator, Four-Eyes, and the little seamstress is not identical, i.e. each character relates to the other three in unique ways. One thing I'm still wondering about is what the exact impact is that Balzac is having on them.
ReplyDeleteI think that reading the book by Balzac is impacting the boys by exposing them a new culture, and making them eager to learn more about it. This is why the go through so much trouble so Four Eyes gives them more books. Balzac gives them a new motivation or goal in the period of their relocation.
Delete1. Our class thinks that the relationships of the characters affects how they take action, and not that the actions the characters take affect their relationships.
ReplyDelete2. How did Four Eyes and the narrator and Luo originally meet?
I think they all went to the same school.
DeleteI think that they all met in school when they were younger.
DeleteI believe that they either went to the same school together or lived in close proximity to one another.
Delete1. My biggest take away from this socratic is people's insights on how the little Chinese might slowly come in between the two friends.
ReplyDelete2. Why do they not mention narrator actual name?
They are writing the book from a first person standpoint and I think that the author just does not want to complicate the story more.
DeleteI think maybe one reason they do not mention the narrator's actual name is so that you can identify with him more. When you do not assign his characteristics to a name and a face, they are simply characteristics that you can identify in yourself and reflect on.
DeleteI think they didn't mention the narrator's name so the reader is able to live in the story more. Since they don't mention his name, it's easier for the reader to imagine themself as the narrator and being in his position.
DeleteI think that the reason the narrators name isn't mentioned is because not only will the reader be able to identify with them but also it helps maintain the idea that anyone could be in his position. So many nameless teens were forced into re-education and the fact that we don't know the narrators name makes it more encompassing. He's just another teen being re-educated and finding himself.
Delete1. My biggest take away was that some negative things are probably coming. We brought a lot of light to all the dangerous things going on and I think that it'll be interesting to see their consequences.
ReplyDelete2. One question I still have is who is the narrator? We actually don't know a lot about him. It's kind of weird how we're seeing the story through his eyes and we never see him. What's he like? What's his name?
Yeah I was wondering the same thing. It is funny how big of a role the narrative plays in the novel yet we still don't even know his name.
DeleteNot stating the narrator's name could be a way of focusing the story on others instead, or he could be creating mystery so he can have a reveal later.
DeleteI have to disagree with your opinion on how we are given a limited amount of information of the narrator. Since the book is written from a first hand view, we are able to get to know the narrator very well from his thoughts and actions as the story progresses.
Delete1) The Little Seamstress comes in between the friendship, not too much, but it's revealing the 3/1000 chance.
ReplyDelete2) What really is what will make you 3/1000?
I think that if you do your work really well and become good friends with your village leaders then you have a good chance of being 3/1000.
DeleteI think to be one of the 3/1000 you have to obey all the rules during your re-education and be approved to leave by the peasants. It helps if your parents aren't very well-known intellectuals. This is why the narrator and Luo think they don't have much of a chance of leaving, because their parents are fairly well-known for their occupations.
Delete1. My biggest take-away is that in the future Luo may start to pay less attention to his friend and more attention to the Seamstress, which may cause some tensions.
ReplyDelete2. Does the narrator really like the Seamstress specifically or is he just using her as a physical manifestation of his desire to be mature and find love? Everybody's opinions on this were different so this question is not fully resolved in my mind.
I personally think that the narrator doesn't really like the Seamstress, because he's barely had any personal interaction with her. To him, she's just a symbol of what Luo has, but he doesn't have. He's jealous of Luo because he feels that shift in their relationship that's been going on ever since they arrived at the village. Luo seems to fit in better here, with his storytelling abilities, and the narrator envies that about him.
DeleteOne major recurring topic I noticed was that as Luo becomes closer to the Seamstress, this may affect his friendship with the narrator and could jeopardize the way the two friends perceive one another during their time in the mountains.
ReplyDeleteI am still unsure about the importance, significance Four Eyes has on the boys?
I think Four Eyes is significant because he is the one who introduced the boys to Balzac, which, so far, has really made an impact on their lives.
DeleteFour-Eyes is important as his books represent Western Culture to the boys. In a place where they are surrounded by illiterate peasants, his books signify civilization and literature and a way to escape the mountain, if only for a short period of time.
DeleteFour-Eyes is the one that introduced Balzac's books to the boys and they will shape how they come to view the world. Though we are not yet sure of the exact importance, you can tell that the books will give them a sense of importance and make them feel more educated. He is also the reason they go to visit the hermit in the mountains and that might become significant later. He shows them how friendships can change when one person has a higher motive.
DeleteToday I was able to think more deeply about the relationships between Luo, the Seamstress and the Narrator. How the concept of jealousy will play a role in the development of the characters and how they interact?
ReplyDeleteI think that both author is saying that both the narrator and Luo like the seamstress and I think that in the future there will be some tension between the two.
DeleteI think that the jealousy will slowly pry them apart. The narrator was constantly used to being the more talented and intelligent of the two friends and their is no telling of what will happen when these roles are reversed.
Delete1. It seems as though there will be a lot more about the relationship between Luo, the Seamstress, and the narrator. The discussion also seemed to keep coming back to foreshadowing things like Luo's death, Four Eyes getting in trouble, and the man on the Thousand Metre Cliff becoming a central character.
ReplyDelete2. Why does the narrator continually leave out names? (his own, the Seamstress)
This is not necessarily what the author intended, but maybe he had the narrator leave out names to show how people's individuality and identity were taken away by Mao's reign, the cultural revolution, re-education, etc.
DeleteI was wondering about that as well! None of the characters except for Luo actually seem to have names. I think this is because the names of the characters aren't actually important to us, it's what they do that matters. The Little Seamstress sews clothes and helps them deceive the old miller, Four Eyes is called that because of his glasses, and he has a secret suitcase of books.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is that the little Chinese seamstress changed the dynamics of Luo's and the narrators relationship, which could lead to them both changing. I think that it sets a good foundation for questions that ask where the story will be going in terms of plot.
ReplyDelete2. After today's discussion, I wonder what the relationship between Four Eyes, Luo, and the narrator is like, and how they are all different.
1. The question of whether the narrator is jealous of the Luo's relationship specifically with the Little Seamstress, or he is just jealous that Luo has an intimate relationship with someone in general. ( I think he's actually jealous of the Little Seamstress, rather than Luo.)
ReplyDelete2. Does the emphasis on the fact that a character dubbed Four Eyes is hiding secret books mean something?
I think he is called Four-Eyes because he wears glasses, however this may be considered a stereotype of intellectuals, just like having a large amount of books.
DeleteI feel like the author may have just done this to be ironic but it doesn't really change the way he acts in the story.
Delete1. The relationship between Luo and the narrator has changed a lot since the beginning of the book: the narrator used to pity Luo for not having any special talents, but now he's jealous of him for fitting in so well with the village and developing a relationship with the Little Seamstress.
ReplyDelete2. Will this changing of relationships affect Luo and the narrator's chances of being able to go back to the city?
In answer to your question, I believe that it will affect their chances of returning. If they keep getting involved in the business of Four Eyes, who would rather sacrifice his friends than stay in re-education forever, they will most likely be caught and never return home to the city.
DeleteI feel like the tension rising between them could potentially cost them their chance back into the city. Since in the village, they basically only have each other and depend on each other to complete their tasks.
DeleteDo we think that this gap will spread between Luo and narrator or they will realize their differences can benefit each of them and their friendship will continue to grow?
DeleteLuo and the narrator's friendship is changing since they have come to the mountain, read Balzac, and met the Little Seamstress.
ReplyDeleteWill Four-Eyes' obsession with the journalist job warp his view of what the world should be? (ex: changing lyrics of folk songs)
I think that Four Eyes' perception of the world has already changed because of the journalist job; he has now become willing to endanger his friends in order to get out of re-education. He has been overcome with the selfish need to get himself out of there, putting himself above his friends and changing the lyrics of the old man's song.
DeleteIs it really his obsession with the journalist job, or his obsession with leaving at all costs?
DeleteFour-Eyes is becoming increasingly more and more infatuated with his goal of becoming a journalist, and although his worldview may not have been much different before, it will certainly become one centered around himself above all else.
DeleteI believe it has already shaped his world view. I do not think it is that he wants the journalist job that bad, but he wants to live up to what his parents wanted for him. Since he was isolated from his parents and their guidance because of his re-education, he still wants to make them proud of him by obtaining the journalist job.
DeleteI think that to Four-eyes the job means hope, a way to escape and become 3/1000. I think he would go very far to keep that hope, and so that may affect his view on the world.
Delete1. Luo and the narrator's relationship is likely to undergo some major changes due to the dynamics with the Little Seamstress as the novel continues.
ReplyDelete2. Based on what we have seen of the narrator's character so far, is he likely to t towards Luo because he is jealous of the Little Seamstress?
1. There is budding jealousy and we are starting to see bits of separation int he relationship of Luo and The Narrator, the seamstress has a part in this but other things like ambition and personality also seem to be splitting the two friends.
ReplyDelete2. The books that 4 eyes has hidden away. Will more of them be revealed to
us ? What will Luo and the narrator have to do to get more books and how far will they go for books?
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DeleteThe books will most likely come up more later, based on the fact that the title has Balzac in it (so his books must be important to the plot) and the fact that the narrator speaks about how much the books impacted their lives later.
DeleteI think that more books will be revealed to us and I wonder if there could be a friendship breaking task between the to to acquire more books.
DeleteI think that the books will have a very large impact on the character's development. It is the only outside knowledge they have had in their whole life, and answering your question I think that they will go very far to get the books.
Delete1. The relationship between Luo, the narrator and the Seamstress is a little twisted with jealousy and some hidden emotions and distrust, and the relationship between Luo and the narrator and Four-Eyes is murky with some hidden intentions and differing values.
ReplyDelete2. Is the Seamstress able to tell the Luo doesn't fully love her the way she loves him?
How do we know that Luo doesn't love the Seamstress like she loves him? So far in the story, we haven't actually seen too much of their relationship, we have only had it told to us by Luo and he seems to be pretty invested in her. The way he was excited to go and tell her Balzac's story showed that he was genuinely interested in sharing his excitement with her.
DeleteI think she is probably caught up in the whole aspect of love and may be a little ignorant of details like that.
DeleteI don't think she's able to tell right away because of the amount of attention and affection Luo is giving her at the moment. But I think later on in the story the Little Seamstress will realize Luo's true intentions and about how he feels about her.
Delete1. Luo is starting to put the narrator after the Little Seamstress, making him jealous. Four Eyes is concerned for his future, whereas Luo and the narrator are living in the moment.
ReplyDelete2. How will the Little Seamstress cause tension between the two boys in the future?
I think Luo is going to be more interested in spending time with the Little Seamstress than the narrator, and ultimately might result in him not wanting to go home.
DeleteI think the narrator will become more and more jealous of their relationship, whether it being that she pulls Luo away from him, or that he too wants to find love.
DeleteThe narrator's jealousy of the relationship or of Luo's love will most likely come in play later in the book. Also, the title of the book definitely means that the Little Seamstress has something to do with the author of the book(Balzac)Four Eyes gave the boys, so that definitely will cause some kind of event between the Little Seamstress and the two boys.
Delete1. Luo and thenarator are very different to each other, and their differences might affect the rest of the story.
ReplyDelete2. Are Luo and the narrator becoming less worried about their future?
I feel like because Luo and the narrator are caught up with so many other things in their re-education process they are becoming less worried about their future and they've realized that they have a slim chance of making it out of the process so they are really trying to live life to the fullest.
DeleteI think they are still worried about their future, they have just come to accept that they are stuck where they are so they started changing their thoughts to where they are now.
DeleteI don't think they're becoming less worried, in a sense they are becoming more distracted by other things. Luo with the Little Seamstress and the narrator with Blazac and the books.
Delete1. All of the main characters in the story have their own unique traits that characterize who they are, and can be extremely different as a result. However, they are also all connected in their pursuit of acquiring new knowledge and becoming increasingly more intellectual.
ReplyDelete2. Can the connections of the characters be sturdy enough to hold them all together, or can their differences be enough to become alienated from each other?
My biggest take-away from today was probably the fact that the narrator is jealous of Luo not just because he has the little seamstress, but also because he has a better set of skills for living the rural farming labor lifestyle. It seems that more people like Luo even thought he has no specialized skills. The jealously will probably in the future affect the relationship between Luo and the narrator.
ReplyDeleteMy question is: Why does four eyes feel so afraid of all of the villagers and so nervous when they are around?
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DeleteI think he has trust issues because he is teased so much for his classes and if they knew what he was hiding he would become in dnager.
DeleteHe is always nervous when the other villagers are around because he wants to impress them. To be one of the 3/1000 you have to impress the villagers, and they have to like you, so Four Eyes feels pressured to do everything right around them.
DeleteMy biggest take-away from today's Socratic was the discussion about the different priorities and values of all the characters, and I'm interested in how that will develop further on in the book. What motivates Four-Eyes to keep those books, even though he is so terrified of upsetting the revolutionaries?
ReplyDeletethink that four eyes has the books because he can't let go of his home. He constantly has the idea that he must return home and the books are almost like incentive. He is willing to alienate his best friend to get home so keeping books as a reminder seems rational for him.
DeleteI think that Four Eyes is motivated by his desire to become journalist. This is a goal for him and to reach that goal, he is willing to take certain risks.
DeleteI think that Four-Eyes is motivated to keep the books because he might be having a hard time letting go of his life back home. He probably is still getting used to the situation that he has been put through and might even be a little bit angry about it. The books probably feel like something that is constant. Also, Four-Eyes is concerned about getting this job, and a background of literature and having references will probably help. I think it is a struggle for control, and having the books or having the job might be a way for him to have more control.
Delete1. Tension has been building between Luo and the narrator because of the Little Seamstress and their differing personalities. Their friendship with the Little Seamstress has weakened their strong bond, and the narrator's jealousy of Luo has potential for becoming an issue later on.
ReplyDelete2. How were Four Eyes and his parents able to hide the books from the Red Guards?
1. I was the outside circle but hearing and taking notes refreshed my memory and it made me have a better understanding about the book and some questions I had were answered.
ReplyDelete2. I predict Luo and the narrator are going to get in a fight.
I feel like because Luo and the Little Seamstress have developed such a fine relationship, the narrator is going to feel left out and thus become irritated with the fact that Luo has time to spend with a girl he has just met, while Luo and the narrator have been friends for a long time.
Delete1. My biggest takeaway is a clearer understanding of Luo and the narrator's relationship. We examined in depth the tension that is caused by the Little Seamstress and the clash of personalities between the two boys.
ReplyDelete2. How will Balzac's writing influence the Little Seamstress? There are amazing similarities between her and the character in Balzac's book. How will this affect how she makes decisions in the future?
I think the Little Seamstress will realize that Luo is not necessarily the right person for her to be with. Balzac's stories may open up her mind to the possibilities of being with other people, or even just being independent. Independence is not an ideal emphasized or encouraged in Chinese culture, and I think Balzac's writing may encourage her to think for herself.
Delete1. Luo and the narrator are not really going to be friends because they are trying to find some way to stand out in the re-education process. Luo is really successful because he is able to entertain the people while the narrator is less successful because he has more intelligent talents which don't really work in the re-education world.
ReplyDelete2. Is their a reason why four eyes gives Luo and the narrator that specific book authored by Balzac?
1) My biggest takeaway is probably seeing and acknowledging the different perspectives on many events that have happened in the book. Sharing out opinions and thoughts while listening and understanding other people's perspective really gives me a broader view of the book. It makes me view the meaning behind this book and many of the actions that happen in this book on a whole new level, since I was introduced to many new things that I would not have thought of on my own.
ReplyDelete2) How will Luo and the narrator's relationship change throughout the book given the different factors that will influence it?
I think that the narrator and Luo may grow apart as they realize that they each value different ideals. The growing jealousy between them may drive them apart further.
DeleteI definitely think that the two boys' characters will butt heads and get in some fights because the strains in their relationship. I think that their friendship is tense because one of them is "succeeding" so to speak in terms of having a woman and being able to entertain people.
DeleteI think they will grow apart, but soon realize they are all each other has, and come to respect each other.
Delete1. My biggest take away was the fact that the Narrator could possibly not be directly jealous of Luo and the Seamstress but that he could be jealous of having a relationship in general.
ReplyDelete2. Will the relationship between Luo and the Seamstress destroy the friendship between the narrator and luo?
I like your idea on not being directly jeaous of Luo and the LCS but of just a relationship. Are there any other women around for the narrator to start a relationship with? Is the LCS his only option?
Delete1. The biggest takeaway I had from today was the predictions that everyone had about the future. There were a few about if the narrator and Luo were going to run away and a few about weather or not the narrator felt jealous about Luo and the seamstress. Not all the questions were answered and I felt that the discussion was more focused on the little details that were in the book.
ReplyDelete2. How does the narrator feel about the Seamstress and Luo?
He might feel a bit jealous about their relationship. However, we don't know how this might affect their relationship later in the book.
DeleteI think that the narrator is jealous of Luo because he has someone to love, but not because it is the Little Seamtress necessarily.
DeleteI felt like the biggest take away had to do with the relationships between the four main characters, the narrator, Luo, the Little Seamstress, and Four-Eyes. There relationships and the way they interact with each other has changed since the beginning of the book and will continue to develop in a way that increases conflict.
ReplyDeleteA question I still have is how Four-Eyes and his parents were able to sneak out the books. How will Four-Eyes books affect his future plans?
1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is the influence of the Little Seamstress and the book upon Luo and the narrator. I think they will both affect Luo and the narrator's relationship either in positive or negative ways. Whether or not it will tear them apart, though, is unclear.
ReplyDelete2. Will the old man with the songs come into play more? Will Luo and the narrator visit him in an attempt to gain knowledge about the culture of their surroundings?
1. The biggest takeaway from this discussion was that everyone focused a lot on was the fact that everyone thought the biggest change because of Balzac has not happened yet in the book. People believe that the impacts from Balzac's book can be extended even further for coming of age.
ReplyDelete2. Why doesn't Four-Eyes trust the narrator and Luo?
He does not trust them because they can accidentally spill the beans about the books through talking too loud or showing other people the book.
DeleteMy biggest take-away from this socratic seminar was are the characters really growing up? Are they coming of age properly? Is it too fast because they are being forced to be independent and work on their own? This is a big topic that I can relate most of the quotes to and find more quotes about that will help me figure out my opinion on these questions.
ReplyDeleteIs Luo using the Little Seamstress or is the Little Seamstress using Luo? Both have different motives that could play in to what's is going to happen.
1. My biggest take away from today's discussion is the influence that the book had on the children. I think a lot of conflict is going to arise within themselves because they want to stick to the rules and ideals of Communism in order to hold on to the bit of hope they have of returning home. At the same time, they want to expand their perspective and are getting influenced by movies and novels. A main take away is it is really easy to be influenced and conflicting when you are growing up and coming of age.
ReplyDelete2. How will the books and movies they see in the future affect Luo and the narrator? Will they rebel? Or will they conform in order to be sent back home?
The question that you have remaining is a really good one. I never really thought deeply about that one, so it is cool that you have.
DeleteI think that at first they will conform in order to be sent back home. However eventually I think they will lose hope in being sent back home by being good so they will try to be sent home by rebelling.
DeleteMy biggest takeaway from this discussion was centered on the coming of age of the characters, and how they way they are growing up now is very different from the way that they would have grown up if the cultural revolution had not happened.
ReplyDeleteA question I still have is the way that the narrator feels about Luo and the little seamstress. At first, he didn't seem to be bothered by it, but now he is a little jealous.
1. An important idea of this discussion is the theme of coming of age and how re-education has affected and shaped their lives. We discussed how Luo and the narrator were forced to guide themselves through their lives, and had no influence from their parents to help them on their journey.
ReplyDelete2. Has the cultural revolution piqued Luo and the narrator's interest in books simply because they are banned? Does it make them want to read even more than they did before the revolution?
That is a great question, but another thought you can add to that is whether they just thought the book was interesting, or if the cultural revolution and hearing all of this for the first time is adding to that as well.
DeleteYes, I think that now because that they are banned, their interest has been sparked and they want to read more now. They want to know what is so bad about books that they have been banned. They also are very interested now after reading one book.
Delete1. The biggest take-away from today for me was the different ideas of growing up. There were many places in which people pointed out coming of age quotes and ideas that I didn't notice, and that was really interesting. The most thought-evoking question was the one about them being forced to grow up or not because of the area in which they live.
ReplyDelete2. How much pain will Luo and the narrator go through in order to keep some freedoms and be the 3 in 1,000 that get sent back to their village?
1. The largest takeaway I gathered from this Socratic is that the lack of outside world influence could seriously mess up one's education.
ReplyDelete2. What relationship does the narrator desire with the seamstress? Could he be jealous of the level of intimacy held by Luo and she?
I think that the narrator is more glad that Luo has found a relationship and that he isn't jealous because it benefits his best friend.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from today is how this quote, "...not for a moment did we image that our lives, particularly Lou's, were about to be completely shaken up" (20) will relate to the rest of the book and how we already see this starting to happen when Luo sees the little seamstress after reading the Balzac book.
ReplyDelete2. One question I have from today's socratic seminar is are the kids being forced to grow up while they are still too young and not ready?
Luo and the narrator in a sense are being pressured to grow up. As many others have noted during the first half, the children are forced to care for themselves without any parental supervision or support, which is causing them to make their own mistakes instead of their parents explain what they should or shouldn't do. This is causing the Luo and the narrator to make descisions that may seem radical, but to them they are just ignorant of what mistakes they might be making. So yes, the children are being forced to grow at too fast.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from the discussion was the idea that the clock stands for much more than it actually did. By moving it around, it shows that even though Lou and the main character were given responsibilities and left on their own, they still could not be trusted to be completely responsible and honest all of the time.
ReplyDelete2. What influence will the Little Seamstress have on Lou and the main character? Was the main character's flash of jealousy because of the book that he just read or will it grow to something that might tear them apart?
I think that the flash of jealousy he was referring to may stem from him possibly thinking that the Seamstress could be taking away the friendship he had with Luo. He feels like he's kind of losing his best friend.
Delete1. My biggest take away was coming to a greater understanding of how their "special" enviroment they live in is affecting the Narrator and Luo (growing up too fast).
ReplyDelete2. What role will Balzac have later in the book? (Because it's in the title but it hasn't had a too big influence).
The Balzac book is influencing the boys because they are being reminded of true feelings, such as passion and love. When they remember these feelings and emotions, the boys act upon their feelings.
DeleteCurrently in the story, Balzac's book has a tremendous influence on the boys and the seamstress. The romantic story is unlike anything they have ever read, so in a way it already has a big influence. I think that Balzac will continue to influence the story as the main characters read more and more of his books.
Delete1. My biggest take-away was how much the idea of a "set path" affected the minds of my classmates. I had not thought about that, exactly, as I was more immersed in the theme of the adolescent life in the isolated villages, but it made me think quite a bit about your destiny and how that can change so very quickly. For example, Four Eyes was destined to be a writer. The moment he had to be re-located, he probably imagined that his destiny would be as an aging, lonely worker in a village far away, forever locked in abandon. However, his parents saw an opportunity to change that destiny by giving him the books and keeping him educated from afar. That was a take-away that formed in my mind after today's Socratic.
ReplyDelete2. What does it mean to be happy? With the books now educating them and their social interactions in the village, with the seamstress, Four Eyes, and their immersion into the community, could Luo and the narrator potentially be happy as they grow up into adults?
I think happiness is very subjective. The seastresses father for example seems very happy with his life, and because of that people like being around him. Also the village headmaster also seems pretty content with his life despite having a lot less than other people. I think the mere fact that the narrator and luo have had better makes them upset becuase they compare what they have to what they had, but with the introduction of these books maybe they will be able to see the beauty in what they have. Four-eyes was blinded in this lastest chapter by his need to get home, so while he may be happy in the momment im not sure it will last.
DeleteTo be happy means to be satisfied with what onself, their desires, their peers, and/or their actions. However, this satisfaction does not necessarily have to be in good-nature and benevolence, but rather for selfish benefit. For example, Four-Eyes sees an opportunity to escape resettlement by presenting authentic folk songs and become a journal editor. However, he claims that the songs that Luo and the Narrator present to him are offensive and "...useless garbage...". Therefore, he decides to tweak the words, and in doing so, ruining the authenticity of the piece but making it more presentable to the journal. He feels delighted that there is an opportunity to escape the resettlement, but he accomplished this through means that may not be ethically sound. Therefore, it is possible to be happy, but perhaps not necessarily for the right reason. For example, Luo feel happy in the company of The Little Seamstress not because she is a good friend, but rather because she can satisfy the adolescent desires of Luo.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is how it is difficult to tell whether Luo and the narrator are growing up too fast during their resettlement, or if they are struggling with growing up and taking responsibility for themselves now that they are independent from their parents.
ReplyDelete2. What are the narrator and Luo willing to do to get their hands on more books from Four-Eyes?
I agree, and it would be interesting to know how they are growing up differently in the Phoenix of the Sky rather than in the traditional city environment that they're used to
DeleteLuo and the narrator seem to be willing to do practical anything! Last night's reading, in which the boys got in that emotional and heated fight put on display their intensity and eagerness to get a book. They will fight long and hard for it. At first, their hardest battle was to get home and be one of the three in a thousand, but now, it seems like they will fight just as hard to get their hands on a book.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is that Four-Eyes is becoming more and more of an important character in the story. Even though he was just introduced, he has already given Mozart and Luo something that will change their lives forever.
ReplyDelete2. Why did Four-Eyes give Mozart and Luo the specific book by Balzac? Was it a coincidence or does it have a significance?
I believe that Four-Eyes chose to give that book was because it was the smallest, rattiest of the bunch he had stowed away in his hidden suitcase. On page 55 the narrator states "-a thin, worn volume. The authors' name was Balzac." I would theorize that he gave them the smallest one, as to avoid giving away hints to the real treasures in his case,
Delete1) With the restrictions of the reeducation, the main characters are forced to grow up quickly and possibly faster than they should be. They are having to conform to the communist ideology and the work load of the village.
ReplyDelete2)When is a person really grown up? If the characters are forced to grow up too quickly, should they really be treated as adults? I am also unclear on how this could affect them in the future. Adolescent actions with adult topics can lead to adult consequences.
It's interesting to see how they grow up in such a restricted environment without the guidance of their parents. I feel as if soon they will face consequences for their actions that they have taken, without any guidance.
DeleteMy biggest take-away relates to the connection between being forced to grow up and how it influences people. For example, Luo and the narrator change the time on the rooster as a way to cope, and the seamstress's father acts more childish because his wife died.
ReplyDeleteI still have questions about other ways being forced to grow up will influence a person.
I think that it will mainly change the way people view the world and their experiences based on the knowledge they have. If they are forced to grow up at a faster rate than they want, they may view the world in a more negative way than others.
Delete1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was that I realized that the narrator and Luo was growing up really fast but not necessarily for the better, especially with the scene under the ginkgo tree.
ReplyDelete2.My question is that why don't the author reveal the narrator's name?
I think that there could be a lot of reasons for the narrator not to have his named revealed. To begin with, it adds a mysterious aspect to the narrator, and makes him feel a little less impersonal. Throughout the novel you get to learn a lot about the narrator, but there will always be that small basic thing that you will never know, which makes the book much more interesting in a different way.
Delete1. My biggest take-away from today's discussion is the influence re-education has on Lou, the narrator, and Four-Eyes. The discussion on if they are growing up too quickly, and if it's a good thing. How is being re-educated affecting them.
ReplyDelete2. How will the Balzac book continue to play a role in the rest of the story? Are they going to get more books?
We both share similar the same take-aways from the Socratic which is really interesting to see!
DeleteThe question if they are growing up to quickly was also a take away I had chosen. From my point of view I believe they are growing up to quickly. In the wrong ways.
DeleteThe Balzac book shapes the boy's perspective and influences them.
Delete1. Learned that the relationship between Luo and the little seamstress could be used later in the story to give more power to Luo because of her father.
ReplyDelete2. I did not get to ask my question if coming of age is affected by the age of the people around you.
I think it is, because if the people around you are more mature, you might take longer because you know that there's nothing really at stake; on the contrary, if everyone else is younger than you, you're going to have to be much more mature a lot faster.
DeleteIt certainly affects you sense an old person might lecture you how to yield responsibilities, while, a little kid just wants to play games with you.
DeleteMy biggest take away from the discussion today is that Luo and the narrator are being forced to grow up so fast, so is that really going to be beneficial to them and their re-education?
ReplyDeleteI think that growing up too fast might hurt the narrator and Luo in the long run, as they are not getting to experience their last moments of childhood, and eventually will not get the lessons from that childhood that will be important later in life.
Delete1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was the significance in these small moments of freedom, coming of age, and simple experiences that mean so much to the narrator and Luo and what impact they have on them because of he suppressed society they live in.
ReplyDelete2. Why is the narrator all of a sudden jealous, does he too have feeling for the little seamstress?
I think he is jealous because of reading the book by Balzac. He wants to be able to experience the same feelings that Luo has towards the little seamstress.
DeleteBiggest Take-Away: People think that Luo and the narrator are maturing/coming of age at a faster rate because of their repressed society. Originally I thought that they might be maturing at a slower rate because of their over-controlling society.
ReplyDeleteQuestion: Where is the narrator's coat now? How does he feel about such incriminating evidence against him floating around in the world somewhere?
I don't see how their society is over-controlling besides deciding who is re-educated where, because once the people are re-educated, they're left on their own to finish their work and do whatever they want in between, giving them a sense of responsibility they probably didn't have before.
Delete1. The discussion really made me look at the two chapters we had just read in a new light. Personally I didn't like these two chapters because there where only a few places where I felt a connection, unlike the previous chapters, but this talk opened my eyes (just like luo's and the narrators) to the important aspects in these chapters.
ReplyDelete2. This discussion made me wonder:
Is it possible to be yourself in a communist society or can you only truly be yourself in a capitalist free society or is it just our biased viewpoint that makes us think this way?
I think you can always be yourself, no matter what kind of society you live in. However, the society you live in will impact how much others can see into your true self.
DeleteFor 1, I felt the same way. We had a connection with Luo and the narrator because we too are learning from our peers as they are learning from the peasants.
DeleteI believe that the society we live in and our surroundings always shape who we are, and that there is no such thing as one's "true self." Everyone fundamentally acts a certain way in different situations, so someone's identity might be different in a communist and capitalist society, but they will still be acting as themselves.
Delete1. My biggest take away from today's discussion was about how Luo and the narrator are learning more about themselves without their parents. They are without guidance, which makes their understanding of things completely different from what they would have learned back home with their families. Now that they are in the countryside, they are faced with a lot of new responsibilities and have to learn to take care of themselves in a different way.
ReplyDelete2. Because they are living under completely different circumstances, are they learning things in a less civilized, "bad" way? And is their Coming of Age turning out to be a good or bad thing?
Since both Luo and the narrator were deprived of learning advanced math and sciences, they have far less career options available in their future. Coming of Age is turning out to be a bad thing for them.
DeleteI think there are differences in the two cultures they were and are being raised in, but this manner might cause them to be less civilized, or effect them negatively. Living by themselves in the village without any parental guidance might result in some issues for them later on. Having that guidance while growing up is crucial for a healthy development. I think that it is a worse living environment than they were living in before at the city.
DeleteIt may not be a less civilized way, but they are growing up much faster than they should be, because they lack the guidance of the average child, and so they must learn to fend for themselves within a completely different society, so their Coming of Age will be much different than they imagined. They are trying to grow up, but they really are still children.
DeleteI guess it is rather difficult to find categorize the main characters' coming of age as a good thing or a bad thing. Rather, the road that these individuals take may not be the best path to take, but it depends on how Luo and the Narrator learn from their situation.
DeleteMy biggest take away from today's discussion was that the communist society was forcing Luo and the narrator grow up faster than a normal person would normally make the transition to adulthood. Because Luo and the narrator have been removed from their family, their new "parents" is the communist society, which forces them to mature at a systematic rate.
ReplyDeleteWhat is the significance of the name of the Little Chinese Seamstress not being revealed? Is it a cultural convention, or is it something purposely done by the author?
I think that the Little Chinese Seamstress actually does not play a huge role in the story. She serves as someone for Luo and the narrator to talk about and share stories with, but has not impacted the plot much. Also, the narrator may want to give her a sense of privacy or secrecy to keep the reader guessing.
DeleteI think that the significance of the Little Chinese Seamstress not given a name is either the same significance as the narrator not having a name, or to display that perhaps women were not treated as fairly. Also, it seems to be that people are defined by their place or role that they play (i.e. headmaster, narrator, farmer, etc).
DeleteIn my opinion her name was undisclosed to leave uncertainty and wondering in the mind of the reader. Also I think that the the author purposefully did that to show that her name and place in society don't matter in the long run and in terms of her relationship with the boys.
DeleteI agree that there is definitely a shift in both Luo and the narrator, as they are forced to take control of their own lives. They have no parents to look after them, so they are essentially on their own.
DeleteThe Little Seamstress does seem to have a very big role in the book, as her name is in the title. This also prompts me to question why her name as well as the narrator's name is never addressed so far in the book.
1. One big takeaway I had was hearing the opinion that the introduction to lust and impulsive actions that can be found in Western culture, such as Balzac's writing, may not be a good influence
ReplyDelete2. Does forcing kids off the path set by their parents yield more or less possibilities for them?
I think the point of sending them off does teach them how to be more responsible. It also teaches the youth about how different life is for those who don't live in the city and opens up their perspective, in a way.
DeleteI think that the kids being forced off the path that their parents wanted them to take will lead to more possibilities for them, but not necessarily good possibilities.
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ReplyDelete1. My biggest take- away from today's Socratic Seminar was that how diverse the class thought about how the boys from the story were growing up. It was interesting to see how both arguments of the boys growing too fast, or not growing at all were both really valid ideas. That made you more aware of different perspectives- which was really cool to see.
ReplyDelete2. Do the boys use one another to try and cope with their new life? They both only have one another and it seems like instead of crying and being sad they use each other to grow and in a way to move away from their past and move on with life.
You had a really interesting take for 2. I hadn't thought about them using each other to cope so much and it makes sense. And for 1, I agree, there was a lot of different mind sets being voiced and each was logical
DeleteI think that although they are probably very sad, they cannot dwell on that feeling and the memories that make them sad. I think they use each other to stay positive, and possibly start their own life together.
DeleteThey are lucky to have such a powerful friendship and they definitely give to strength to each other in times of need.
Delete1. My biggest takeaway was the both boys seem to place their values on different things. The narrator seems to be placing all his priorities to retain as much information from the banned books he's getting from four eyes, while Luo places the Little Seamstress above everything else, making sure she's the one who "learns" from the banned books.
ReplyDelete2. How did Four-Eyes manage to get a suitcase full of books past the red-guards, and what is the significance of Balzac and his books and how does it tie into the story?
My theory is that the Red Guards did not expect for Four Eyes out of all people to be hiding secret literature since his eyesight is so awful.
DeleteI was wondering the same question as you, He might have disguised it some how
Delete1. My biggest takeaway is that we have seen a little impact on the characters lives but not enough
ReplyDelete2. Will Luo and the narrator pursue their parents dreams?